Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby daryl » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:54 am

UPDATE - the carboy and contents are up to 95F.

There is not alot of out-gassing, but there is more sediment in the bottom of the carboy...probably from the lacto kicking in.

What was interesting, there was significant trub from the wild/spontaneous fermentation that occurred, that I observed when I racked this Frankenstein into the carboy. So I am wondering how much fermentable sugars are available to the lactobacillus?

Will crank it up to 100 this evening.

How long should I keep this creature in the fermentation chamber? What do I monitor (SG, pH, ?)?

And, should I finish the kettle souring process, and add a beer yeast to finish - or go straight to bottling?

Borrowing the name from Steven Prochaska; if this turns out decent, I am going to call it Dankenstein!

If it doesn't, it will be good starter for the septic tank! :shock:
In the Fridge/On Tap: Salted Caramel Porter
In the barrel/conditioning:
In the bucket: P-nut Brittle Ale, Blueberry and Blk Rasp. Mead; Tangerine Wheat; Spont. Funk; Swarthy Beagle
In the queue: Pils Urquell Clone, Traditional Irish Red Ale
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby mjensen52402 » Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:01 am

Checking your pH might not hurt. If it is above 5 add sone lactic, or a small bit of phosphoric. It always took mine a while to get started.
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby daryl » Thu Oct 12, 2017 2:58 pm

So this batch set at 100F for almost a month; and the Lactose really did not take off. It has been in the fridge now since then at about 45F.

Some have sampled it, and it seems to have the proper 'funk' taste, but it needs the lacto-sour.

Pat suggested I brew 5 gallons of sour and blend...not a bad idea; and I get 10 gallons of beer.....not my most favorite style, but if it's good, I am sure I can get some help liquidating it.

But Mark was talking about using 88% Lactic Acid....sounded like the acid acted as a catalyst to get the lacto to kick in.

After all of this time, if I raise the temp on this beer, is there any reasonable chance that adding the lactic acid will have the desired effect? I was thinking of adding a eighth of a teaspoon? Should be more?

If I do add it, and it succeeds, how long will it take?
In the Fridge/On Tap: Salted Caramel Porter
In the barrel/conditioning:
In the bucket: P-nut Brittle Ale, Blueberry and Blk Rasp. Mead; Tangerine Wheat; Spont. Funk; Swarthy Beagle
In the queue: Pils Urquell Clone, Traditional Irish Red Ale
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby wyzzyrdd » Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:23 pm

You go to BIY and buy a little bottle of lactic acid. Add a bit at a time until you get the level of sour you want. Then you are done. Keg it.
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby mjensen52402 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:30 pm

If you hopped the original wort the lacto will never do anything.
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby daryl » Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:31 pm

wyzzyrdd wrote:You go to BIY and buy a little bottle of lactic acid. Add a bit at a time until you get the level of sour you want. Then you are done. Keg it.


I can do that. How much would you suggest I add for five gallons?
In the Fridge/On Tap: Salted Caramel Porter
In the barrel/conditioning:
In the bucket: P-nut Brittle Ale, Blueberry and Blk Rasp. Mead; Tangerine Wheat; Spont. Funk; Swarthy Beagle
In the queue: Pils Urquell Clone, Traditional Irish Red Ale
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby daryl » Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:33 pm

mjensen52402 wrote:If you hopped the original wort the lacto will never do anything.


That is exactly what happened. And what makes this more surprising is that the wild yeasts took hold. When I make my plambic wheat base, I will use debittered hops.

Ok, so I've learned quite a bit from this.

Thanks everyone.
In the Fridge/On Tap: Salted Caramel Porter
In the barrel/conditioning:
In the bucket: P-nut Brittle Ale, Blueberry and Blk Rasp. Mead; Tangerine Wheat; Spont. Funk; Swarthy Beagle
In the queue: Pils Urquell Clone, Traditional Irish Red Ale
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby karl » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:33 am

Yes, I've learned from reading this too. Good discussion. Thanks all!

Karl

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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby andrewmaixner » Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:51 am

daryl wrote:
mjensen52402 wrote:If you hopped the original wort the lacto will never do anything.

That is exactly what happened. And what makes this more surprising is that the wild yeasts took hold. When I make my plambic wheat base, I will use debittered hops.

Those will still stop the lacto. most lacto is VERY hop-sensitive (even 1 IBU equivalent will stop it). Boil with no hops, and when desired acidity has been reached, then add the dried hops to the fermenter.
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby twiggy2164 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:24 pm

Just curious Daryl, what was your calculated IBU's? I read a lot saying 10-20 was still ok with lacto, my sour is about 6 IBU and I'm freaking out now.


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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby daryl » Tue Jan 23, 2018 11:13 am

Sorry Travis, the IBUs were just over 20. How did your sour come out?

So...I am still dinking around with this carboy of dank. It has been at 56 degrees for months....three or four circles of growth are floating on top of the beer (nickel to quarter sized), is this to be expected?

I have the lactic acid to sour it...and will probably do that soon.

But in the meantime, the wild yeast or bacteria that took this batch over, I am thinking left behind fermentables for yeast. Should I pitch some ale yeast in there and see what happens prior to souring it?
In the Fridge/On Tap: Salted Caramel Porter
In the barrel/conditioning:
In the bucket: P-nut Brittle Ale, Blueberry and Blk Rasp. Mead; Tangerine Wheat; Spont. Funk; Swarthy Beagle
In the queue: Pils Urquell Clone, Traditional Irish Red Ale
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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby twiggy2164 » Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:17 pm

It’s getting sour, I pulled a sample just before xmas and it’s getting a good sour aroma. The taste isn’t quite there yet.


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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby MikeB » Tue Jan 23, 2018 9:32 pm

daryl wrote:Sorry Travis, the IBUs were just over 20. How did your sour come out?

So...I am still dinking around with this carboy of dank. It has been at 56 degrees for months....three or four circles of growth are floating on top of the beer (nickel to quarter sized), is this to be expected?

I have the lactic acid to sour it...and will probably do that soon.

But in the meantime, the wild yeast or bacteria that took this batch over, I am thinking left behind fermentables for yeast. Should I pitch some ale yeast in there and see what happens prior to souring it?

What is the ph of the beer at this point? How much has the gravity dropped from the og? What do the circles of growth look like? Are they fuzzy or green/blue at all? If they are just white and not fuzzy at all should be nothing to worry about. I don’t know about pitching yeast at this point, kind of depends on what the gravity is I would
think.


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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby MikeB » Wed Jan 24, 2018 10:30 am

Sorry to ask so many questions . I’m just more curious than anything. I recently did my first kettle sour and ran into a few things along the way so I’m curious how yours will end up in the end. I did end up pitching more yeast with some honey in mine after about 5 weeks since I thought there was still some fermentation to be finished but it didn’t really do anything and I think I might be throwing the whole batch away now since it smells terrible.


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Re: Sometimes The Day Doesn't Go As Planned....

Postby daryl » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:36 pm

No problem, I'll try to remember to pull a sample this weekend. It the taste has gone south, I'll dump it.

The last time I tasted it, it had the funk, but no sour; I have the Lactic Acid to sour it up, but I think I might drop some active yeast in it to see if there are any more fermentables.

The lacto did not work in my case because I had hopped the wort.
In the Fridge/On Tap: Salted Caramel Porter
In the barrel/conditioning:
In the bucket: P-nut Brittle Ale, Blueberry and Blk Rasp. Mead; Tangerine Wheat; Spont. Funk; Swarthy Beagle
In the queue: Pils Urquell Clone, Traditional Irish Red Ale
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